K2: Sajid Sadpara’s Story

K2 Winter 8000ers
Sajid Sadpara. Photo: Elia Saikaly

In summer 2019, Sajid Sadpara became the youngest person to summit K2. This year, the 22-year-old dreamed of becoming the youngest to step on his country’s highest mountain in winter. Instead, he survived a traumatic solitary descent of the mountain, after leaving his father behind.

Back home, he had to deal with both his own sadness and that of his family. He has also had to navigate unfamiliar attention — honors, public admiration, and the media clamoring to hear his story. Often, these published accounts have misinterpreted technical details (hours, locations) or made real errors, such as the last words between Sajid and his father at the foot of the Bottleneck. The BBC, for example, recently suggested that Ali insisted that his son should keep going to the summit at all costs, despite problems with his oxygen mask, when in fact it was the opposite.

Ali Sadpara’s close friends, Rao and Moirah Ahmad, have kindly translated our questions to Sajid, and conveyed his answers to us, as well as helped detail the events of February 4-5. The Ahmads served as the Sadparas’ spokespeople throughout the expedition and so have the background to properly present Sajid’s amazing story.

January 15 — The Nepali Summit Push

John Snorri and Ali were in Camp 2 for the second day. Originally, they had planned to go up to Camp 3, but a pessimistic forecast and a strong wind where they were discouraged them from going further. Nevertheless, they sent Sajid up to bring some gear to Camp 3.

Sajid reached the lower Camp 3 at 7,000m, where he met Sergi Mingote and JP Mohr. Mingote asked Sajid: “Are you guys not going to the summit with the Nepalis? They are leaving tomorrow.”

The three-man team of John Snorri (centre), Sajid (left), and Ali Sadpara. Photo: John Snorri

Snorri and Ali knew nothing of the Nepali plans and only found out when Sajid returned to where they waited in Camp 2, below the Black Pyramid, too far away to join the push.

That day, Mingote wrote that they were in the Japanese Camp 3 and the “two strong teams on O2 [meaning Purja’s and Mingma G’s] are one camp above. With the good forecast for tomorrow, they may try it [the summit],” Mingote concluded, later mentioning that he saw Sajid earlier, bringing Snorri’s gear to C3.

At the end of his post, Mingote wished Purja and Mingma G’s teams all the best. There were no further posts from Mingote. On January 16, the Nepalis summited and Mingote tragically perished during his descent.

February 4-5 — The Second Summit Push

Nearly 40 people started up K2 at the beginning of February, buoyed by the short weather window predicted for February 5. While the odds of summiting were low, and although some of the climbers retreated from Camp 1, about 20 people reached Camp 3 between 3 pm and nearly 8 pm on February 4.

Colin O’Brady was first, then his Sherpas with his tent, then Juan Pablo Mohr, who also carried a tiny two-person tent for himself and Tamara Lunger. Ali carried the tent he would share with John Snorri and Sajid. Apparently, one of the Sherpas had another tent. And that was all.

Snorri and the Sadparas ended up sharing their tent with at least three more people, unable to lay down, change socks, eat, or melt snow for water. Most of all, they couldn’t get any rest before their final push. For that reason, the three of them set off toward the summit later than planned.

Snorri, the slowest in the team, left at 11:30 pm. Ali, always fast on the mountains, followed at 2 am. Both used supplementary O2 — each carried two bottles.

K2 under the stars. Photo: Tamara Lunger

Sajid set off at midnight, two hours ahead of his father, since he was using no supplementary O2. He wanted to try and bag a no-O2 summit for Pakistan, as well as to break the winter age record since he is five years younger than Gelje Sherpa, who was the youngest on the Nepali team that summited three weeks earlier. Nevertheless, he carried one bottle for an emergency, plus an extra bottle for Snorri.

On the way, he crossed paths with Slovenian Tomaz Rotar, who was on his way down after being unable to cross what he described as an “unpassable crevasse 2.5m wide” at around 7,800m.

Eventually, Ali caught up with Sajid, and they saw Snorri and Mohr at the edge of the crevasse. Together, they jumped the crevasse. Sajid is positive that there was no rope and that the jump was very long and “pretty scary”. But they neither used nor fixed any ropes.

Where did they cross the crevasse?

This is one of the most confusing parts of the story. Sajid said that the three of them knew about the crevasse because the Nepalis told them about it after their summit. However, Mingma G has explained that after failing to find a way to pass this obstacle on the Abruzzi route, he and those with him retreated almost back to Camp 3, where they took a different way, more or less following the Cesen route. They found a passage around the crevasse with a very steep ramp on the other side.

Mingma G noted that right after Camp 3 there was no rope, but the fixed line started 250 to 300m above camp. It then continued up the entire route to the summit. He also remarked that the crevasse was fixed with rope.

Sajid Sadpara in Base Camp, with Broad Peak behind. Photo: Elia Saikaly

Could Snorri, the Sadparas, and JP Mohr have taken a different way, following the Abruzzi Spur rather than the Cesen, and therefore crossed the crevasse at a different point, far from the ropes? If so, the team soon returned to the main path, because there were ropes at the Bottleneck, Sajid says, when he turned around.

Sajid’s retreat

Sajid says that as they proceeded up, he developed a splitting headache. This is why his father told him to start using O2 before they proceeded up the Bottleneck. They were at 8,200m and it was 10 am. “The sun was shining, everyone was climbing well, and feeling good,” said Sajid.

But when Sajid tried to switch on the oxygen, his regulator failed, with oxygen leaking out. Ali then gave him a radio and told him to return and wait back in Camp 3. Already suffering from the symptoms of AMS, Sajid admits that he can’t recall the descent well. “At about noon, I have this memory of looking back and seeing my father and the rest on top of the Bottleneck, about to start the Traverse, but I am not sure anymore if that was real or if I dreamed it,” he said.

Somehow, he crossed the crevasse again. “I nearly fell,” Sajid said. “I jumped and only one of my feet reached the other side.”

He managed to make it safely back to Camp 3 by 4 or 5 pm. “I don’t know why it took me so long to get there,” he admitted.

He made some tea and contacted Base Camp. At 7 pm, the weather worsened. At around 11 pm, Sajid went outside and looked for the headlamps of his father and the others, but he saw nothing. The following morning, the crew in Base Camp convinced him that he had to go down, to save his own life.

“I do not think they got sick, they were feeling fine,” said Sajid. “There must have been some kind of accident.”

It takes about five hours from the beginning of the Bottleneck to the summit. If everything went well, they could have reached the summit by 3 pm. Sajid, Snorri’s widow Lina, Rao Ahmad, and all Pakistan wish that they summited before their fatal accident. The fact is, no one can know for sure. The agreed-upon call from the summit never came, neither from the climbers’ satphones nor their InReach trackers, which can send SMS messages.

The thorough investigation that followed the climbers’ disappearance discovered that Snorri’s Thuraya satphone had apparently tried to make a call at 7:17 pm that day at the altitude of Camp 3 — not right on the tent’s location but closer to the Cesen route. Just in case, the helicopters made sure to search that precise area, but they found nothing.

However, there was no way to know if this was a real call or some system glitch. If real, it is not known if it was a pocket dial or a deliberate call to a number. In either case, the communications company can’t determine the number that Snorri might have been trying to reach, according to Moirah Ahmad.

The later flights up and down their route, the plane carrying infrared cameras, the ground search by four climbers from Ali and Sajid’s village…all found no trace of the trio. So their fate belongs to the mountain, unknown at least until their bodies are discovered, and left for us to speculate what might have caused them to vanish into the jaws of K2.

+18

About the Author

Angela Benavides

Angela Benavides

Senior journalist, published author and communication consultant. Specialized on high-altitude mountaineering, with an interest for everything around the mountains: from economics to geopolitics. After five years exploring distant professional ranges, I returned to ExWeb BC in 2018. Feeling right at home since then!

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delwyne trefz
delwyne trefz
1 month ago

Thank-you Angela, Sajid and the Ahmads for your dedication to providing an accurate picture of the details related to this tragic summit push.

+26
Yuriy
Yuriy
1 month ago

Just out of curiosity as it’s not so important and wouldn’t change anything. Mr. Samson Simon Sharif interviewed Sajid and also reported the fact that they just jumped across the crevasse. I was surprised because the crevasse made the Nepali team retreat and find the new route in order to avoid the obstacle. When I pointed that out, Mr. Sharif said there was another crevasse near the bottleneck, and this is the one they jumped across. A bit confusing and not clear how many crevasses they had to navigate. It doesn’t matter at the end, just shows how difficult to… Read more »

Ali Baltistani
Ali Baltistani
1 month ago
Reply to  Yuriy

Ali Sadpara and John snori might fell backside of the summit due to a high speed snowy wind…

+4
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago

“But all was not well. Trackers were dead and sat phones switched off. Even Sajid who parted company at 12 noon due to oxygen malfunction returned to Camp 3. Anxious and worried, he dared the climb back towards Camp 4 to find nothing in extremely poor visibility. Dawa Sherpa who had the latest weather reports advised him to descend immediately to Base Camp which he did by midnight.” (from Mister Samson Simon Sharif blog) https://sharafs.wordpress.com/2021/02/23/clearing-the-plume-k2-winter-2020-21/ At around 11 pm, Sajid went outside and looked for the headlamps of his father and the others, but he saw nothing. The following morning, the… Read more »

Paul
Paul
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

He went only outside the tent to check for headlamps light
and he start descent at the morning 6th February.
Samson Simon Sharif is confusing many facts in his writing but it gives lots of info as well.

+7
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  Paul

Thanks. Yes they are many confusing facts but i appreciate Mr.Sharaf’s efforts. We also heard something from Sajid that was not heard before. “Already suffering from symptoms of AMS, Sajid admits that he can’t recall the descent well. “At about noon, I have this memory of looking back and seeing my father and the rest on top of the Bottleneck, about to start the Traverse, but I am not sure anymore if that was real or if I dreamed it,” he said. What if it was an ilussion (caused by altitude sickness and lack of oxygen) and they didnt cross… Read more »

Last edited 1 month ago by Boz Šahin
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

Rotar said the same thing– he has no recollection of how he descended.
So all the survivors who climbed much beyond Camp 3 have acknowledged that their reports might not be accurate.

+6
Paul
Paul
1 month ago

Thank you Angela for this interview. When comparing John Snorri Tracker (after ignoring the aberrations/ errors) it make a clear path that follows much more to the felt (towards Cassen Route) than trackers from summer expeditions so they know where to go. The problem is that if there was not constant fixed rope from C3 they easily lost it in darkness. One of the difference between the summit push on 16th Jan and 5th Feb is that the Nepalese team knows exactly where to go during the night because they checked the route during the day, the summit push on… Read more »

Tom
Tom
1 month ago

I told myself I won’t speculate, but here I am, speculating (I apologize). Is it possible that they summited around 3 PM (still daylight) and at 7 PM (darkness), when Snorri tried to make a call from his phone, were again at crevasse on their way down, but this time couldn’t jump over it in fell into it? 

+2
Paul
Paul
1 month ago
Reply to  Tom

Not possible that they made summit by 3pm, too fast, if they was at the top of bottleneck at 12noon it is not possible to reach summit by 3pm.

+3
Don Paul
Don Paul
1 month ago
Reply to  Tom

It would explain why no helicopter or F16 could see them anywhere, if they fell into the crevasse. One detail I wish Sajid had explained, was whether the three others were tied together, and if so, how much rope was in between them? One person jumps over the crevasse, the others dig in their crampons and axes and get ready to catch a fall. Why would anyone NOT do that? I always assumed that the three must be tied together, since all three disappeared. Something happened to one of them, who took the others with him. But this detail isn’t… Read more »

Last edited 1 month ago by Don Paul
Moirah Ahmad
Moirah Ahmad
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

They were not roped together. He doesn’t think falling into the crevasse is a possibility, not for the 3 of them. He thinks was an accident down the traverse or Bottleneck while descending.

+2
Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago
Reply to  Moirah Ahmad

Not to rope from Camp 4 to summit is technically suicidal. It is too steep, narrow and dangerous, especially knowing that in past climbers have been swept by winds. Then Sajid confirms there was rope fixed all along. Mingma G had fixed ropes on this route in 2017 for Liang Zang and Snorri. The summit Video is in HD.
https://youtu.be/TqxE4OAAzac

+1
Tom Noaker
Tom Noaker
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

Good point; it seems the crevasse is the cause of this tragic ending but of course timing, darkness, high winds and perhaps O2 failure could have been the cause.

+2
Don Paul
Don Paul
1 month ago

Either there was a rope across the crevasse, as Mingma G says, or there wasn’t. Now there are two crevasses and they jumped across a different one where there were no fixed ropes. I think I’ve read in other articles that Ali urged Sajid to continue, and that all of them were on supplemental O2 except JP Mohr. Some of the contradictions aren’t easily explained.

+3
Don Paul
Don Paul
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

I’ve also read that JP Mohr was carrying some rope but no sleeping bag or tent. Why not use it at the crevasse? It sounds like the most frightening move on the route, and was the reason Tomaz Rotar and others turned back. According to Mingma G, it was all fixed and he rappelled the entire route from anchor to anchor. Even if there was an avalanche, it would have to take out both anchors to remove the rope completely, and then the destroyed anchors would still be connected to the remaining ropes. It’s not making sense.

+5
Last edited 1 month ago by Don Paul
Taulia
Taulia
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

It says at the top of this article that the claim of Ali encouraging Sajid to summit was false. “The BBC, for example, recently suggested that Ali insisted that his son should keep going to the summit at all costs, despite problems with his oxygen mask, when in fact it was the opposite.” The journalist who wrote that article didn’t interview Sajid and wrote a false sensationalized article. Sadly this is confusing the narrative. Try watching Moirah Ahmed’s video on youtube – she is in direct contact with activity/reporting from BaseCamp and close to the Sadpara Family.

+4
Don Paul
Don Paul
1 month ago
Reply to  Taulia

Sajid is denying that he was interviewed by the BBC at all? I would be amazed if the BBC journalist didn’t record it. The claim that the journalist lied was made by Sajid’s friend Moirah Ahmad. However, she also said that Ali was climbing WITH O2.

https://twitter.com/moirahahmad/status/1361320361221107713

Not that it really matters, but these stories are just not adding up.

+3
Last edited 1 month ago by Don Paul
Don Paul
Don Paul
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

It doesn’t matter to me if Ali was climbing with or without supplemental O2. I would respect someone more, who has more respect for their own brain cells. O2 deprivation from altitude causes severe brain damage. Here’s one of many sources claiming Ali was climbing w/o supplemental O2:
https://www.thenews.com.pk/print/787812-ali-sadpara-a-gem-gone-missing-in-k2-snow

+3
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

I believe both Sajid and Rotar said Ali was climbing with O2 (at least above Camp 3). It was Sajid who was going without O2, until he got a severe headache. As to the BBC article or Sajid’s report, I think we should believe Sajid. And Rotar. They were there and have no reason to lie about this.

+5
Moirah Ahmad
Moirah Ahmad
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

I claimed so because he was climbing with O2, it’s not a secret. Both John and Ali were using from C3. Which I can’t see the issue in that, or people’s resistance to it, because at the end of the day O2 or not it doesn’t matter. The BBC journalist, that is local by the way, took the information out of the press conference that Sajid was forced to do by the media on February 7, just as he got out of the helicopter. Still, during that q&a he didn’t say that, we have the recordings. Ali was not in… Read more »

Don Paul
Don Paul
1 month ago
Reply to  Moirah Ahmad

OK, the BBC reporter lied and just wrote the quotations himself. Does Sajid deny being interviewed by Aamir Latif as well? https://www.aa.com.tr/en/asia-pacific/pakistan-loses-iconic-climber-ali-sadpara/2142664 “Scaling the K-2 in the winters and without (supplemental) oxygen was his longtime dream. He was very excited about this expedition,” his son, Sajid Sadpara, told Anadolu Agency.“I saw him on Feb. 5 at the height of 8,200 meters from where the bottleneck (a steep, narrow gully on the edge of the ice on the glacier surface east of the summit) starts. He was a few meters away from me,” Sajid, 23, recalled, adding that “He asked me… Read more »

Stephen Frank
Stephen Frank
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

He was probably sick, there is no reason to lie. It’s obviously confusion
It’s not like one version is making him or his father look better or worse. His brain wasnt functioning correctly, and even him remembering jumping over could be wrong. At the end of the day his account isn’t going to be reliable if he was suffering from AMS

+2
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

Don’t assume either is lying. Confusion. A situation where Sajid had just arrived back from K2. Probably several journalists, and not clear they identified themselves before all questions, or that Sajid could keep them straight. He’s not exactly media-trained, and he was likely still suffering from the trauma of loss.
And plenty of room for misunderstandings, by anyone, especially journalists unfamiliar with mountaineering. We have seen that throughout this whole story.

+3
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

And here is another problem: it is well known that witnesses to traumatic events (or even non-traumatic ones) are not reliable. Among other things, their recollections are fluid and often influenced by questions, previous discussions, or by what someone else said. Lots of studies about this.
And those are not even cases where the witness was exhausted, oxygen deprived, and suffering from the death of his father and climbing companion.
Give people a break, especially Sajid.

+5
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

I hope Angela’s interview with Rotar addresses the questions of the number and location of crevasses and whether each had ropes in place. Rotar’s published blog, google translated from Slovenian, is not clear on these points. Also not clear whether or what extent Mohr joined Snorri and Sadpara while climbing, since Rotar mentions Mohr climbing alone, “as always” or some such phrase. Certainly chaotic conditions in the tents at Camp 3 make it easy to understand why rope could be left behind accidentally by Snorri and Sadpara, but it is hard to believe that they would make a decision to… Read more »

Yuriy
Yuriy
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

I am also wondering why Rotar turned back. Seems like the crevasse was not impassible if Snorri and others managed to get across. Maybe he was at the different location along the crevasse and it was too wide there… But it was a good decision from his side that probably saved his life.

+3
Yuriy
Yuriy
1 month ago
Reply to  Yuriy

Was Rotar climbing on oxygen or without?

+1
Max Madera
Max Madera
1 month ago
Reply to  Yuriy

He was using oxygen.

0
Yuriy
Yuriy
1 month ago
Reply to  Max Madera

Thanks. It would be interesting to hear his story, especially in regard to crevasses. It’s been pretty hazy so far

+1
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

Both Sajid and Rotar acknowledged that their recollections could be faulty or even imagined. Besides fog of fatigue and altitude, recollections may differ because there was more than one crevasse, the crevasse(s) reported by the Nepali team could have widened weeks later (enough for the fixed lines to get pulled out) or they could have ended up at different points in the crevasse(s). And there is an element of one person reported something to another and to to another…as well as language issues. Finally, in his sleepless and O2 deprived state (on the climb) and in grief (later) Sajid may… Read more »

Don Paul
Don Paul
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

There’s no way the fixed lines were pulled out. It’s just not physically possible if they were fixed to anchors at both ends, and those anchors were tied to other anchors, all the way up and down the mountain.

+2
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

I wrote that because Rotar seemed to be saying something like that, although the google translate from Slovenian is a mess: “The glacial rift that stopped our advance was at a point where the rope was too far wide for anyone to jump over. It is possible that the Sherpes came over the crack with the help of a ladder, but they deny this. If the crack had expanded to the described width in fourteen days, the rope that had been routed over it would have been torn for the time before the expansion, but it had been hung for the time… Read more »

jajo_majo
jajo_majo
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

I can. wich sections are you interested in?

+1
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

You are correct, i also could not imagine that all of them jumped 2,5 m under such circumstances. And again, Sajid on his descent jumped alone over this crevasse, and his physical and mental state deteriorated even more after Bottleneck due to the lack of oxygen. These events are very mysterious.

+6
Don Paul
Don Paul
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

Mysterious yes. But more climbers will be on the Abruzzi Spur around June, and no doubt will be thinking about this the whole time. Will the crevasse still be there?

That makes me wonder, with all the high technology aerial surveillance, do they have any pictures of this crevasse? I saw one picture on Chhang Sherpa’s instagram page, but it was of the upper parts above the bottleneck.

+4
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

I looked at Chhang Sherpa posts from 07.02.21. and 08.02.21. Can you look at post from 07.02. and pictures 1,2 and 6. I can not identify it near Bottleneck, are you able to identify these locations?

+1
Helen
Helen
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

Could this crevasse be it, at 1:59min ?
“Historic K2 Nepali climbers send a strong message of unity” (on Youtube):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQMSzPyYnp0&fbclid=IwAR3_sHLE0bVm2vl9F56XOYxXen5mspvTSj01-dgFi8aKtSfD9Tft6nRNY6Y

0
Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago
Reply to  Helen

Good Observation

+2
Helen
Helen
1 month ago

Thank you!

0
Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago
Reply to  Helen

Just confirmed. This is not the crevasse. Sajid called it a minor crevasse

+2
Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago
Reply to  Helen

No according to Sajid

+2
Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

I located two from a YT link yesterday but Sajid told me these were not the ones

+2
jajo_majo
jajo_majo
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

Rotar said that there was a rope across the crevasse, and also that the rope was slack, so the crevasse didn’t widen. Also states he is pretty sure it was the rope that the Nepali had fixed.

+1
Joanna
Joanna
1 month ago
Reply to  jajo_majo

But maybe they have eventually found a better place to cross the crevasse? And there was no rope in that place? I’m curious what Sajid can say about the width of that crevasse in the place they jumped. We only know from Rotar it was 2,5m wide but he wasn’t there with the 4 of them when they crossed it.

+1
Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago
Reply to  Joanna

Sajid said it was 2-2,5 meters wide. Excerpt from my article,

According to Sajid, already a summiteer on K2 in 2019, the landscape ahead of camp 4 was completely different. There had been heavy snow and a big crevasse about 2.5 meters had opened up 50 M ahead of Camp 4 site and the Bottleneck. Sajid confirms that the Nepalese briefed them about this crevasse at the base camp but it had since widened. 

+2
Joanna
Joanna
1 month ago

Thank you for a reminder, one can get lost…

+1
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago

First question. Is it possible for them to jump over this crevasse (that was 2,5 meters) under such circumstances? They were at 8000m, they were tired (not resting and sleeping well in tents), they had boots etc. And second question, how quick crevasse can get more wide in shorter time frame (few hours, one day)? Is it possible for the crevasse to get 0,15m-0,2m more wide in few hours or even 0,5m in 24 hours, because even ‘minor’ changes on the crevasse would make it impossible to jump over it again. Somehow, he crossed the crevasse again. “I nearly fell,”… Read more »

guwinster
guwinster
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

I feel like 2.5m is probably close to the max I could jump in full gear. Regardless of the crevice’s actual width, he more pertinent question is whether they would have enough energy to jump it at night, on their descent 10~ hours later. If it was at all a tenuous jump on the way up, it would probably be impossible to make the jump on the way down. Also, there are a million things that could make it easier to jump one way, but harder to jump the other. Maybe one side had a steeper gradient or less space… Read more »

Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  guwinster

Yes i agree with your statement. Even if they manage to descent back near that crevasse, at that time they would be exhausted, exposed to very low temperature for far long, and their oxygen would quickly be depleted and JP wasnt even using oxygen.

0
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  jajo_majo

Do you speak/ read Slovenian? It would be great to have a good translation of the post Rotar wrote, and info about any other interviews or writings about his experience. He and Sherpa Timbo were the only people who reached the major crevasse and returned.
Hope someone interviews Sherpa Timbo as well.

+2
jajo_majo
jajo_majo
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

I will try to do it in the evening over pint of beer. Hope I find the time.

0
Mikael Funch
Mikael Funch
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

Good points. To me its totally impossible to jump a 2.5 meter hole under these circumstances unless the opposite landing side is much lover.

+2
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  Mikael Funch

And at the end we dont even know if this cravesse was 2,5m or less at the given time.The people who saw it at the morning of 05.02. had fatigue and some of them were lacking oxygen. The only ones who saw it at that time and survive to tell were Sajid, Tomaz Rotar and Sherpa Timbo. Out of these three only Sajid saw it at daylight.

+3
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

And according to Rotar, who says he and Sherpa Timbo examined the crevasse for 200 m. and the place he met Snorri was the best place to cross. He also implies that search took him an hour: ” I had enough time ( before Snorri arrived) to inspect at least two hundred meters of the crack before he arrived, along with Sherpa Timbo, and found that the best place to cross was exactly the one I had shown him, but the gap was too wide to be able to skipped. Sherpa decided that the conditions were too difficult and that he would… Read more »

Nathalie Lafleur
Nathalie Lafleur
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

I thought the same about the crevasse … but for me there is an important missing part in this . Sadji doesn’t explain how him and his father crossed the crevasse after witnessing Snorri and the others jumping it without ropes and he founds this very scary to look at. I cannot beleive that 1st these elite climbers- Snorri and others took that kind of risk and 2nd, that Ali and his son did the same
I would have like him to tell how they did

0
Farukh Ali
Farukh Ali
1 month ago

Thank you for bringing us Sajid’s story, Angela. I pointed out in previous posts that weather was deteriorating on 5th Feb and winds were picking up. One climber uploaded IG video of C3 on 5th Feb morning, showing little visibility and winds above C3. Although, according to the forecast, winds were gonna pick up from early 6th Feb Saturday. The weather window was shorter to return back to C3 but doable by those 3 experienced climbers.

+2
Summit Certifier
Summit Certifier
1 month ago

They did not summit. Something unfortunate must have happened during the ascent.

+2
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago

We neither can say they submitted nor they didn’t… but from Sajid’s account of the final events he witnessed, it is likely they submitted. Something happened during descend. To jump back 2.5 meter crevasse at night is dangerous. But they would not have jumped all together and failed. Crevasse can’t be a cause to lose all 3 best climbers. It just doesn’t make sense. …besides assumptions, reality will remain a deep mystery…

+4
Last edited 1 month ago by Tenzin
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  Tenzin

They were very experienced and strong climbers. But after long exposure and after their oxygen got depleted, it is possible that they did make some irrational decisions.
What do you think about this?

Also its very strange that call was attempted from Snorri’s satphone at 7 pm (daylight was already gone).

+2
Nathalie Lafleur
Nathalie Lafleur
1 month ago
Reply to  Tenzin

What about if one of them jump and felts while the others who hold the safety rope slip or were too tired to hold strongly enough and were brought with him into the crevasse

+1
Mountain
Mountain
1 month ago

They had great advantages and opportunities to conquered K2 in winter as all the ropes were fixed by Nepalese climber, fixing ropes takes hell of a time. It seems Ali Sadpara and Snori may have conquered K2 but may have fallen on the other side due to high wind. Also , each of them were carrying 2 bottles oxygen, isn’t that heavy at that height. Theirs radios were not working Sajid was in Hallucination due to lack of oxygen. Ali Sadpara and John Snori were carrying 2 bottles of oxygen which is heavy, Sajid oxygen regulator not working properly. To… Read more »

Last edited 1 month ago by Mountain
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  Mountain

As clarified by Mingma G and Mingma David, Nepali team didn’t cut the ropes. There is no question about it. But the Nepali team made a big detour to avoid crevasse… so the ropes obviously will not be on the normal route from camp-3 to camp-4. I think Ali Sadpara team didn’t follow the Nepali climbers route. Sajid could have clarified about it. Nepali team didn’t mention about jumping 2.5 meter crevasse, so definitely they were at different point of the crevasse. It is all confusing right now. Maybe we will know the detail slowly.

+3
Nat
Nat
1 month ago

I watched Moira’s video on YT. She mentioned that the call couldn’t be traced. I was working for a mobile company 10 yrs ago on a pay as you go department. Even back than we could tell the customers at what time and which number they called. It just stood out for me ,that a likely high- Tec GPS phone company is not able to tell the same.

+2
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Nat

That is an interesting question; was the call completed? Or just initiated? Thuraya satphones transmit their location, at least intermittently, when used. Supposedly the GPS data is encrypted, not clear how securely. Some reports say GPS coordinates are transmitted as soon as the phone is used, other reports say intermittently. In the 2008 K2 disaster, Van Rooijen was located using GPS coordinates transmitted when he called his brother, but that call was completed. Without location data, not sure what this tells us, except that Snorri was still alive at 7pm. Thinking about the scenario when Snorri attempted this call just adds… Read more »

Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

All smart phones and sat phones send a PING regularly.

+2
Nat
Nat
1 month ago

Exactly, so how could they not tell? I’m not saying that they could’ve been rescued (maybe?) but surely would’ve been an enormous help to locate them, so the families can say their goodbyes or lay them to rest..

+2
Tara
Tara
1 month ago
Reply to  Nat

I would’t rely so much on sat phone tech. They just don’t work right in T so much below zero.

+2
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Nat

Supposedly the location ping is encrypted, so might be an issue of how secure and hard to break. 10 years or so ago, there was a recommendation to not use Thuraya in war zones in the mideast, because government authorities were able to get location data from the phones. I imagine encryption has improved since that time.
I imagine they tried to enlist Thuraya to provide?

+1
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago

So it is overstated to say “tried to make a call” at 7 pm, when this could just be a an intermittent ping from a phone that still on?

+2
guwinster
guwinster
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

I haven’t read any actual reports about the Thuraya phonecall. However, the article we are commenting on implies there are geocoords for the attempted call: “Snorri’s Thuraya satphone…tried to make a call…not right on the tent’s location but closer to the Cesen route” Granted those geocoords could be erroneous, especially if conditions prevented the phone from actually completing a call. I suspect the incomplete data on the Thuraya phonecall at 717PM may be due to the phone originally being turned off. Whoever used it then would have turned it on, but before a call could be completed the phone turned… Read more »

Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  guwinster

Sajid also said that at 7pm weather worsened.

+1
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  guwinster

What is your opinion about this? The thorough investigation that followed the climbers’ disappearance discovered that Snorri’s Thuraya satphone had apparently tried to make a call at 7:17 pm that day at the altitude of Camp 3 — not right on the tent’s location but closer to the Cesen route. Just in case, the helicopters made sure to search that precise area, but they found nothing. Is it possible that at 19-19:30 they were at Camp 3 altitude (but on Cesen route). Does this suggest that they aborted their ascent for whaterver reason (shortly after the Bottleneck on the Traverse)?… Read more »

guwinster
guwinster
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

To be clear I’ve never been on K-2… It’s plausible to me that that the Ali, John and JP may have left the route they used to ascend in order to find another way around the crevasse, taking them in the general direction of the Cesen route. They may have even departed the route they used to ascend without knowing it, assuming they accidentally followed the Nepali ropes past the point where they originally joined the Nepali route. In the dark they may have become lost or disoriented and accidentally ended up at a point so far down the Cesen… Read more »

Michèle
Michèle
1 month ago

This tragedy has caused such anxiety and sadness. I have these questions and comments – 1. Statistics are 1 in 4 fatalities of summiters (in summer)! Ten had just made successful summits. So statistically the odds were completely against further success. Many who have perished in the past were highly experienced and competent, so no-one would be exempt from the huge possibility of loss of life. 2. Therefore it would be imperative to put everything possible in one’s favour! 3. The weather window was so short, leaving no margin at all for error. 4. Why then leave late? If one… Read more »

Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago

Drifting to Cesan Route loaded with ice is a far fetched probability. To pass such an idea one has to have ground knowledge of the Abruzzi and its twin spur on the left. In this stretch of K2, it is impossible to climb without ropes and in dark. A confusion has again been created by someone who does not know the mountain terrain and are possessive. Mingma G mentioned two crevasses. Crevasse 1. The first going up Camp 4, where he was tempted to retreat towards Camp 3. He finally found a crack, roped it and then crossed. Crevasse 2.… Read more »

Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago

How many crevasse were there exactly. Which crevasse (2.5 meter) did Ali team jump over to cross it. How did they deviate the crevasse that lies before camp 4. Did they take the Nepali climbers route to reach camp 4. Questions in my mind!

+1
Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago
Reply to  Tenzin

Everyone took the Nepali route. Contrary to what has been told to Angela, Sajid told me that entire route was roped except about 25 meters which was safe. I reconfirmed this. Also note that many Nepalis also went up these ropes on night 4-5 February.

+4
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago

What you have written makes more sense to me. The crevasse they jumped to cross over definitely seems the one below the bottleneck which had widened since the Nepali summit. Angela version raises more questions than answer. But still I thank Angela too for the effort. Thank you Sharaf.

+2
Max Madera
Max Madera
1 month ago

We may not have all details but it really seems to me that Samson got the story right. I mean, we know that at least 6 people went up Camp3 departing at different times at night. (It would be interesting to know if more climbers reached Camp4 or higher.) If they were to improvise a route not following the ropes, how likely would it be that all of them take the same path and stop at the same crevasse and still identify the place as the crevasse that the nepalese found that have widened in the mean time?

+1
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Max Madera

Agree, this idea is supported by Rotar’s report that as he went down (presumably the way he ascended and guided by lines) he met Snorri (at the crevasse), Mohr, Ali Sadpara and Sajid. And Rotar’s personal sherpa was the sixth. Wonder if more people attempted at least part of the route above Camp 3, and if so what they say about the route and fixed ropes.

+1
Karen
Karen
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

I believe I read that Irish climber Noel Hanna attempted the route above Camp 3, then decided against going any farther after he reached the crevasse.

+3
Max Madera
Max Madera
1 month ago
Reply to  Karen

Yes, you are right. According to some British media he reached about 8000 meters. I haven’t read much in terms of details.

+1
guwinster
guwinster
1 month ago
Reply to  Max Madera

I’m not convinced either way on if the February climbers followed the Nepali path out of Camp 3 or made a new path. However, if the February climbers did improvise a new route, I think it would be extremely likely “that all of them take the same path and stop at the same crevasse.” All they would need to do to end up in the same place would be to follow the footprints of the person who left before them. This would be the logical thing to do anyways. You wouldn’t want to break trail through fresh snow when someone… Read more »

Max Madera
Max Madera
1 month ago
Reply to  guwinster

You are Rotar or Hanna: a member of an expedition that prepares everything for you. You even have your own sherpa. You haven’t fixed any line, haven’t prepared any camp. Nothing have been improvised or really decided by you. You are in K2, during winter, at night. Are you going to depart from Camp3 trying to summit (an extrenously long day even for 10 sherpa with more than 200 eight-thousanders combined and a quarter of the route already fixed), trying to find a new route on the way without fixing/equipping any part of it, perhaps even without carrying any rope?… Read more »

Max Madera
Max Madera
1 month ago
Reply to  Max Madera

On the other hand, however, you are right that if someone made a mistake and took a different path, it is likely that the others could just follow the footprints ending at the same point.

+1
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago

In addition, Rotar’s post seems to be talking about a rope or fixed line over the 2nd, higher crevasse below the bottleneck. Wish there was a real translation of this instead of the crazy google translate version: “The glacial rift that stopped our advance was at a point where the rope was too far wide for anyone to jump over. It is possible that the Sherpes came over the crack with the help of a ladder, but they deny this. If the crack had expanded to the described width in fourteen days, the rope that had been routed over it would have… Read more »

Ronald
Ronald
1 month ago

Thank you Angela for all the stories this winter. Nice to hear Sajids side of the story which is telling a lot. I think it is obvious they didnt see the ropes from the nepalis above camp 3 since a little deviation from the nepali path in dark, is enough to not find the ropes. They didnt start directly from camp 3 with the ropes but a little higher up. Than it seems the Nepalis took another route for the crevasse as mentioned and the Sadparas did not take the same route or jumped the crevasse, i really think that… Read more »

Elena
Elena
1 month ago

Dear Angela! Thanks a lot for this interview! I’m happy that Sajid is alive! John Snorri, Ali Sadpara, and Juan Pablo Mohr are heroes for me, regardless of whether they made it to the summit or not. They will remain forever in my heart. It is not only the summit as such that is important, but the very process of achieving it. This team has it flawless!

+3
F v
F v
1 month ago

Did the search team look on the Chinese (north side) of the mountain? Or is Pakistan army not allowed to go across the border? Although not logical they fell of that side because it was a north-west wind that was picking up. But in zero visibility, exhaustion, low ox levels and dehydration you will easily get disoriented.

+2
Tara
Tara
1 month ago
Reply to  F v

Strong wind seems quite possible cause of accident. It happend before several times, e.g. Jeglic, world class climber, was just blown off the near top of Nuptse after climbing the wall alpine style with Humar. They were not roped and it only took one strong blow and he was gone without any trace.

+3
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Tara

Allison Hargreaves too, apparently blown off K2 with 5 other climbers by violent winds.

+2
Saam
Saam
1 month ago

Can someone please help me understand, why John Snorri’s GPS on explore website say last: Feb 13, 2021 7:10AM?

+1
Capture1.JPG
Bill Bones
1 month ago

I’ll wager they made the summit but all perished whilst attempting to get back across that crevasse, this is must be the reson why multiple aerial searches failed to find any trace of them,
Their remains lay in that crevasse
RIP

+1
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  Bill Bones

I dont think 3 brilliant climbers would jump simultaneously to cross the crevasse and fall into it… doesnt make sense

+2
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  Tenzin

I share your opinion. I also do not think that all three of them would jump and fall into crevasse simultaneously as you said. But what if the crevasse got more wider in a short period of time (is it possible?) maybe 0,2m in few hours or 0,5m in one day. If they returned at the place where crevasse was – Ali, John and Juan Pablo could not cross the crevasse until daylight. Sajid jumped over on the descent but this was at daylight. Somehow, he crossed the crevasse again. “I nearly fell,” Sajid said. “I jumped and only one… Read more »

Mikael Funch
Mikael Funch
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

Important and good thoughts and points here aswell as many other commenters and speculations. One aspect I rarely hear in this great forum is dehydration and the problems with balance. Having enough water in this extrem desert must be difficult. I would say a minimum of 5-6 liters pr Day. Your ability to ajust balance is easily ruined when dehydrated. Decending in fading light with your balance in disorder sounds complicated.

+1
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  Mikael Funch

Thanks. Yes there are very good comments (and concusions) here. With new informations arriving – the position from Snorri’s phone when he or someone attempted call (altitude at Camp 3 but closer to Cesen route) and exact time, i wrote other speculation in posts below. If they were at Cesen route at 19-19:30 then they aborted summit push early (for whatever reason) crossed the crevasse (or at least one of them) during daylight but were unable to return to Camp 3 during daylight, and they get lost at Cesen route. Everything was against them: no light, exaustion and lack of… Read more »

Walid Hamadeh
Walid Hamadeh
1 month ago

Sajid can only explain what happened up and until he left the group. Everything else is speculation and since the unknown is intriguing, the human mind begins to spin it, analyze it and use creativity to come up with subjective answers. If my memory serves me well, I believe that Snorri and The Sadparas left base camp around a day later than everyone else. Knowing very well that they have a short window of opportunity to summit. Was that an oversight and an over confidence in their ability to conquer? Did they underestimate the almighty killer mountain? It was a… Read more »

Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  Walid Hamadeh

I have no doubt Sajid Sadpara can/will do great things. The way he handled the last two days of his k2 winter expedition is amazingly brave. I hope Pakistan realizes his potential and support him to achieve his climbing goals.

+2
Aziz ur Rehman
Aziz ur Rehman
1 month ago

Why they did not try the drone camera, that it was already earlier used by the polish climber and skier and his technical team to guide him in his descent and they also helped the one climber who fall on the K2 which was rescued with the help of drone camera. Atleast body can be found by this method. This expedition was sponsored by the red bull all videos are on the youtube.

+1
Paul
Paul
1 month ago
Reply to  Aziz ur Rehman

It was during summer so the temperatures are much higher, as wind not that strong, so it was easier to use the drone.
As well this drone was modified so not sure where they could find any drone that will be able to do such an operation.
Not sure what military drones has Pakistan Army but I guess they considered to use them if they dispatched F-16

+1
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  Aziz ur Rehman

In the winter wind, not possible

+1
Nathalie Lafleur
Nathalie Lafleur
1 month ago

there is an important missing part in thisto me.Sadji doesn’t explain how him and his father crossed the crevasse after witnessing Snorri and the others jumping it without ropes and he founds this very scary to look at. I cannot beleive that 1st) these elite climbers- Snorri and others took that kind of risk and 2nd) that Ali and his son did the same I would have like him to tell how they cross it Finally, with all my respect to Ali who seems to be a great human who was loved and appreciate by all, I am surprise to… Read more »

Don Paul
Don Paul
1 month ago

Pulling on jumars going up 60 degree snow for hours and hours isn’t for me, but I can imagine myself doing it. I can’t imagine jumping a 2.5 meter crevasse with huge plastic boots on, and would never step right up to the edge of it, since it’s just snow. I don’t believe this could have happened the way Sajid said.

+1
Abs
Abs
1 month ago
Reply to  Don Paul

I get a feeling much of what Sajid remembers is hazy – altitude sickness, plus his splitting headache and lack of oxygen means he may have done things differently and remembers them differently .. And why would Snorri/Ali/Mohr feel any different? They were probably as tired, sleep deprived, not much oxygen and also probably suffering from rational decision making (either going up or on the way down) .. either ways – there is a fair error in judgement to continue with the push in those conditions and the weather/time that lay ahead .. not sure how much of this could… Read more »

MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Abs

Snorri and Sadpara were on O2 so should have felt and functioned better until it ran out or malfunctioned. Then they would immediately feel much MUCH worse. Definitely a time when mistakes are made or for an accident.

Not clear that Mohr was ever climbing as a team with them. The only report of that was from Sajid. Rotar seems to believe that Mohr was climbing alone.
For what any of these recollections or assumptions are worth now.

+1
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

When exactly did Sajid have problems with his O2? Didnt Rotar mentioned about Sajid complaining about the Oxygen leak? Where did they meet?

0
Abs
Abs
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

I think Mohr wasn’t formally climbing with them, however considering Snorri, Ali and Sajid were the only ones going up he would’ve tagged along the same route .. after Sajid descended, I guess he became the last 3 on the mountain whether he wanted to go up alone or not becomes besides the question.. On the issue of oxygen, the 2 cylinders that they had, how long do they last.. enough to get them up and back with heavy breathing and possible panic in the dark of the night? I have a feeling that crevasse has something to do with… Read more »

Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago

Opinions about this? The thorough investigation that followed the climbers’ disappearance discovered that Snorri’s Thuraya satphone had apparently tried to make a call at 7:17 pm that day at the altitude of Camp 3 — not right on the tent’s location but closer to the Cesen route. Just in case, the helicopters made sure to search that precise area, but they found nothing. Is it possible that at 19-19:30 they were at Camp 3 altitude (but on Cesen route). Does this suggest that they aborted their ascent for whaterver reason (shortly after the Bottleneck on the Traverse)? Sajid reached Camp… Read more »

Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

You can end up anywhere on the mountain if you don’t have a sense of direction. It is possible what you have suggested. But may i know the source of the quote?

0
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  Tenzin

The source is this article. I dont know if they edit texts after they publish them but i think that this sentence was somewhat different at the time they published this article.

+1
Roland Hoire
Roland Hoire
1 month ago
Reply to  Tenzin

Excuse my English. My friend turned back from 8080m on 5th. Can’t name him. They followed orange colour fixed rope line that the nepal team used. Something is wrong what sadpara jr is talking. No one jumped any crevasse. 2.5 mt jump with gears and angled slope at 8000 mt ? Nonsense. This is not movie. Either he is lying or he saw something terrible happened in front of him. He returned and in shock stayed at C3. No one could summit. FYI,Around 1920 hours the wind speed was above 60mph with jet stream above 8400

+2
Last edited 1 month ago by Roland Hoire
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  Roland Hoire

I am really confused now.

0
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Roland Hoire

Most interesting. Lying is a tough word when more likely he was hallucinating from lack of oxygen. There is no shame to that, so many great mountaineers reported crazy hallucinations at altitude. The lucky ones maintain at least an intermittent lucidity that keeps them safe. but most of those were never grilled for details of their route or descent. If pressed, most would say they don’t really know, as Sajid has said about his descent. And when reality mixes with hallucinations it is not really lying. Sajid already admitted that his report of seeing Snorri and his father past the… Read more »

Roland Hoire
Roland Hoire
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

Sorry English my not native language. We discussed at length on the whole K2 problem with my friend. He is bloody strong technical climber – myself have climbed a few with him in Himalayas, Argentina & Europe but never been to Pakistan. One thing for sure, he told that the Nepali team was a beast – the very best and they climbed like mountain goat (specially he talked of tenzin Sherpa and Chiri Sherpa) and they were ready from the start. good luck on the 15th made them the only team to summit when my friend was in C2 but… Read more »

MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Roland Hoire

Many thanks! I think your English is very good, and you bring up many important issues. The most important is that the route was fixed, and that the climbers were told very clearly (with a topo map) about the crevasses.
Your friend’s comments about the steep wall above the crevasse on the alternate route match what Mingma G described as part of the climb, but your friend emphasizes what a challenging point that was. And not enough attention has been given to that wall.
Finally, no one has mentioned non-disclosure agreements.
Again– danke!

+3
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

I agree the wall seems impossible.

“My friend explain that some vertical of C3 to alternate C4 climb on the 4th/5th was like 10x of Hillary steps with deep wide crack, ice-rock dropping and thats where he stopped and returned when the weather is still good.”

That’s scary!

+2
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  Roland Hoire

Thank you Roland. Your English is good. I understood everything. Thank you for the info… @Angela should take note of it.

+2
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  Roland Hoire

Are you saying that Sajid Sadpara was at tent C3 alone for 23 hours? He arrived there at 16h or 17h, that means that he was there until 15h or 16h next day, so he started his descent to Base Camp very late. I thought that he was at C3 until morning or most around noon.

+1
Last edited 1 month ago by Boz Šahin
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

Hi… if you have Rotar’s article link, can you paste here for me… i want to compare Rotar’s and Roland’s friend’s descriptions.

+1
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  Tenzin

I have, but the text is completely on Slovenian

https://www.gore-ljudje.si/Kategorije/Novosti/le-angeli-imajo-krila

+1
Tenzin
Tenzin
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

Thanks. I will try my best with almost useless google translation! 😀

+1
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

One other interesting point about Rotar’s post (in terrible google translate) is that he mentions meeting Sajid last and closest to camp 3: “Before I returned to the threesome at sunrise, I met Sajid. The son of the great Ali Sakhbara complained to me about the malfunction of the regulator and told him to follow the trinity.” So Rotar gives the impression that Sajid is quite far from the other 3 ascending at that point. Rotar doesn’t actually say that Sajid is ascending or descending, but says Sajid already mentions a malfunctioning regulator. If Sajid was so far apart behind the… Read more »

Anonymous
Anonymous
1 month ago
Reply to  Roland Hoire

All I have to say rn is that your words seem a little too harsh. Sajid is just 22, not only was he recovering from high altitude sickness, but he was also trying to comprehend the grief of having lost his father and being the last person who saw Ali and group alive. At the same time, he was facing unprecedented media attention which he had no idea how to deal with. I dont know much about mountaineering but I’m sure bringing the broken oxygen regulater with him wouldve been the last thing on his mind when he was descending… Read more »

tahm
tahm
1 month ago
Reply to  Roland Hoire

im sorry to say ..focus of your whole comment is “nepaali team is the best and” other fools were there to just risk their lives to show off……..sadpara was son of mountains..he belonged to them…he born there and lived in that village without fancy heating equipments modren houses ..they are snow leopards ..team snori might have done any wrong calculation but you shouldnt disrespect all those who never returned or hardly survived and aborted summit

+2
Chiri
Chiri
1 month ago
Reply to  tahm

That’s an absurd analogy ! Born amidst mountains do not make you a mountaineer. A kid born at Phortse will not be better than Messner!! Saying that – I know Sadpara and he is a brilliant climber. His son is 22, just learning the rope and has the potential. Snorri on the other hand – well, with due respect, is an average rich climber with all the heavy hitting for him has been done by the Sherpas, always, whether broad peak or Manaslu. So yes, he shouldn’t be on K2 winter in that weather & taking away the life of… Read more »

tahm
tahm
1 month ago
Reply to  Chiri

nothing to do with sadpara being a hap…offcourse he didnt have much financial resources but snori was a good human being too he always mentioned sadpara in his posts as a fellow team mate….. you should check sadpara’s interviews and clips.he himself was so eager to conqure shahgori(k2) and after summer summit it was now winter summit he was eyeing.. neapali team is admirable but 40 other climbers were also willing to summit this winter.. its fate which has made team snori to go ahead in that short weather window…but it was Shah Gori who was calling them..we cant judge… Read more »

Mountain God
Mountain God
1 month ago
Reply to  tahm

A bit exaggerated like a Bollywood movie. Nature is the most powerful thing.

+1
tahm
tahm
1 month ago
Reply to  Mountain God

isnt this whole comment section is filled with fiction assumptions and fantasy?….
you may not belong to that soil im talking about..poor people have skill but dont have resources to fulfil their dreams to summit their own mountains…
i just replyed the person who s comment was disrespecting the dissapeared climbers by declaring nepali team only people able to wish this summit

+1
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Roland Hoire

Roland, if you are still here, did your friend say anything about crossing the crevasses, and how wide they were? And how the crossing was fixed? Did the Nepalis just finally find a narrower point that they could cross, a snow bridge, or did it involve more, like a tyrolean traverse? Although I would think a TT would have been mentioned explicitly by Mingma G Also, where was the vertical wall, that was so challenging? Mingma G’s report seemed to say it was after the crevasse before Camp 4, but not clear from your description. I am still surprised that… Read more »

Roland Hoire
Roland Hoire
1 month ago
Reply to  MuddyBoots

Hey MB.. this forum is becoming like a clubhouse room of extra terrestrial story session ! What I gathered from him is on the Cesen route detour that they took, they faced a class 5.7-5.9 rock-ice climbing route at 7700+mtr, which is insane technical to climb at that height, temperature and weight pack..most others already left or returned by then..it was a narrow colouir on the crevasse with vertical fall on both side that they crossed before the wall and there was fixed line but his Sherpa added extra rope with V belay for him..for him it was pushing the… Read more »

Kathill
Kathill
1 month ago
Reply to  Roland Hoire

I don’t understand why your friend want to stay anonymous…as it could be make or break point in this unsolved mystery

+2
Roland Hoire
Roland Hoire
1 month ago
Reply to  Kathill

Because he wants to ! There is actually no mystery. Think logically. Deduce the heresy. Was the weather good enough to go above 8200mt that day and make it back on time ? No. Was Snorri good enough at that challenging weather ? No. Again, Möhr climbing alone made the right choice to move up without o2 and no Tamara to support ? No. Did Sadpara asked Snorri to stop but Snorri decided to move ? We will never know. Is Sajid good for that last 600 mtrs on winter K2 ? Not yet – maybe someday. Did they lost… Read more »

Helen
Helen
1 month ago
Reply to  Tenzin

About the call at 7:07pm. From Moirah Ahmad in comments on Youtube. I recomend listening to her and reading all answers she gives in the comments: “About the call, it’s a mystery. We don’t even know if it’s real or a system mistake. This call has many other implications. For starters the call didn’t went through. By the timing of the call many people assume things, my assumptions are completely different. If the phone was working why they didn’t call from the summit, that means they didn’t summit, or means that the phone didn’t work at the summit but did… Read more »

Helen
Helen
1 month ago
Reply to  Helen
Helen
Helen
1 month ago
Reply to  Helen

To locate the sat call, around C3 at 7:07pm tells me that they are to be found in the “trouble” area between c3 and c4.

+1
Abs
Abs
1 month ago
Reply to  Boz Šahin

Boz if what you’ve said is in any way true.. then there wouldn’t be any ropes on the Cessen route .. right?.. and wouldn’t that make it impossible to descend from there down.. in any light, time or conditions (which were getting worse) .. and they wouldn’t find any recent camp there either.. In my comment reply above i’ve tested the theory of them slipping / blowing off the mountain .. that could have happened on the cessen route’s non-roped section .. Does Sajid say they were roped together? If he was a bit far behind then i don’t think… Read more »

Mikael Funch
Mikael Funch
1 month ago
Reply to  Abs

This possible event Abs proposed happening on the Cesen line I find one of the best of many speculations yet. Plan A and B and C was for the Abruzzi (and allways includes an amount of luck too), but out here we are probably talking plan D = only poor and high risk options all the way around.

+1
Boz Šahin
Boz Šahin
1 month ago
Reply to  Abs

If they were on Cesen route and at altitude of Camp 3 at 19-19:30 it would be impossible to descent because they were to long exposed to freezing temeperatures, lacking oxygen and without daylight. If they were there, they tried to find Camp 3, but unable to do so probably they fall from the mountain, either by slipping or by the wind. But honestly we dont know if they were there at all (and how many of them), but if they were then they crossed crevasse during daylight. But what if there are unknown crevasses at Cesen route and they… Read more »

Abs
Abs
1 month ago

BTW .. has it just been “accepted” that there was no dis-organisation on camp 3 with the 20 climbers sent up and not enough tents (also Elia not finding his Oxygen etc) .. i mean that surely has contributed to their physical ability, leaving for summit times etc .. Is this a norm that the fate of the climbers is accepted and pre-events are not questioned.. i understand this is not a homicide investigation.. just a recovery operation .. but surely there are things not adding up and all involved need to answer .. SST has quietly packed their bags… Read more »

Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago

This is how I plotted the route on Earth Google Pro in Realtime on night 5-6 February. I have identified main places. These may help us in our objective discussion. I had the Realtime help of two Pakistani mountaineers who had climbed K2, twice each (Alpine Style) up to Bottleneck with one summit

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waypoints.jpg
Abs
Abs
1 month ago

Samson Simon Sharaf haven’t we established already that the gps signals were erratic and not reflective of their actual movements? So not sure what we’re getting to with the plotting you’ve done.. Please explain the points you’ve marked so we can have an informed discussion..

+2
Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago
Reply to  Abs

There is very little evidence. We have to wait for Tomaz, Noel and Sherpa Timbo to speak out. Granted, GPS is erratic:
1. It does indicate the direction they went.

2. Last location reported is far ahead of Camp 4. Conclusion they crossed the Crevasse in question rather than what Tomaz speculates.

3. Waypoints 40-43 show them close to the gully of Bottleneck by 7:15 AM. Sajid Parts at 12 noon which is a reasonable time.

I will try sending you tracking in google maps.

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Samson Simon Sharaf
1 month ago
Reply to  Abs

Send me your email.

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question everything
question everything
1 month ago

Sajid tweeted that he will lead a search and recovery operation for his father and his partners:
https://dailytimes.com.pk/728259/will-leave-no-stone-unturned-to-recover-my-father-says-sajid-sadpara/
It’s good to hear…

+1
Last edited 1 month ago by question everything
Can Naci Duman
Can Naci Duman
1 month ago

Why it makes me feel that now this Sajid Sadpara is trying to grab limelight after talking nonsense for few days !! Whatever I have heard of him from people who has seen him – he is an over smart new age fellow. Whereas Ali Sadpara always been highly respected and remembered fondly by peeps who went to Pakistan. Seems this young Sadpara is trying to monetise the situation, some gofundme campaign to be followed, taking out ropes atop a 8000meters requires humongous effort, manpower and money !! His father was a good effervescent climber, this guy is turning out… Read more »

tehm
tehm
1 month ago
Reply to  Can Naci Duman

he is the youngest to summit k2 already…dont degrade a young fellow who has lost his father

+1
MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Can Naci Duman

Sajid is a young man who lost his father. he has been thrust into a situation that is tragic. Sajid was never trained to deal with the media, which is undoubtedly demanding statements and stories. Give Sajid a break, he is under tremendous pressure and he never asked to be in the limelight.

+2
asho
asho
1 month ago

In the other interview Sajid said the crevase was 2 meters wide!! He also said he jumped the 2 meters crevase with those heavy Mountain suits at the limits of Toposphere at 7500Meters. I think Sajid was on lack of O2 hallucinations and taking it for real.

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Mikael Sandager
Mikael Sandager
1 month ago

How can three persons disappear at the same time and place if not in an avalanche? What are the options? Just a question from a novice: Under wich circumstances would three highly experienced climbers tie/fix them selve together by rope on K2 and risk death of all?

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MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago

Not established that the 3 climbers were lost at the same time and place; maybe they were, maybe not. Mohr was not formally climbing with Sadpara and Snorri, and no one returned to tell what happened. Could have been 1 accident or 2 or 3 separate accidents. Roping together also cuts both ways. It could save your life if you partner manages to stop a fall, or you could both/all go down together. It depends on the skills of the climbers, the circumstances, and luck. Here is the most famous “saved by the rope” story, and it happened on K2:… Read more »

MuddyBoots
MuddyBoots
1 month ago
Reply to  Beckss

Beckss, I hope you will post this link on a more recent discussion about K2, where more people might see it. This is an important interview with Tamara Lunger, extremely sad. And she doesn’t carry grudges and seems very objective. She didn’t go to the summit, but she spent the last night at Camp 3 with JP Mohr. Lunger knew both Mohr and Ali Sadpara very well (from other expeditions) so she had more insight into their state of mind than other Camp 3 climbers. Lunger adds some new details: Ali Sadpara’s frightening message before beginning the final ascent .… Read more »

Dr MCS
Dr MCS
1 month ago
Reply to  Beckss

Wish some one posts English Translation

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Irfan Najam Sheen
Irfan Najam Sheen
1 month ago

Sajjis Sadpara developed High Altitude Cerebral Edema which was evident from his symptoms. He developed splitting headache and he had altered sensorium therefore he didn’t remember what happened exactly. He was probably hallucinating as well. That’s why he took too long to descend and couldn’t recall all the events well. This makes the situation more confusing because the only witness available was not well himself mentally at the time when this tragedy was about to unfold.

+1
Yuriy
Yuriy
1 month ago

If it was HACE, alone and without assistance he would be dead. He was suffering from AMS.

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Don Paul
Don Paul
1 month ago

Could this explain why Sajid’s regulator didn’t fit the O2 tank? Was one or the other Russian?

https://youtu.be/Aga3ReuQYEU?t=793

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Last edited 1 month ago by Don Paul